Kelly you are right, NO Help from City or County in the clean up..SOS home owners responsible for all.. If you had transposed the same fire with similar conditions to California or Idaho would it have been managed the same way? When one seriously examines the events, these lives could have been spared despite the power of fire and wind. if/when evacuation notice was given. Lastly, I would after this last election year never ever put stake into social media as any sort of official news, witness accounts or other fact finding mission. I was near Gatlinburg until Saturday prior to the fire, visiting my family. The notice went out to people within 10 miles of the fireline. SOURCE Like this: Loading. If you search around, you can find a recorded radio transmission by TN Forestry personnel from that fateful morning (my old brain doesnt remember where it was posted and I didnt bookmark it, but some other WFT readers may know). Money and CNN. Cafe 420 and Gifts of Gatlinburg were also destroyed. Im hoping at this point, its going to be pretty quick. Sevier County remains Smokies Strong 5 years after wildfires - WBIR.com They need to be accountable for their inaction, and action. No. Even life-long locals said they had never seen rhododendren wither up before. They should not be excused because they did not escape the consequences this time of their lax policies and their actual failure to follow the procedures they should have followed. Body found in rubble of Gatlinburg fire - wtvq.com May all the people find peace and forgiveness in the midst of this storm. Why are there not more prescribed and controlled burns being conducted? Too old to start over, fear it could happen again and they could be in their home like I was, or out and out mistrust of local government. But very little if any fire suppression activity occurred until Monday, November 28. Paddlers prepare to hit the water for the return of the Kualoa Hakipuu Canoe Festival, Former Mililani High athletic director indicted, Hawaii police departments offer big incentives as competition for new recruits heats up, Stroke survivor's specially-modified bike returned, Midday Newscast: City proposes $300 tax credit for those with homeowner's exemption, 'The Other Side of Paradise' with Lynn Kawano, KHNLPUBLICFILE@HAWAIINEWSNOW.COM (808) 847-3246, KGMBPUBLICFILE@HAWAIINEWSNOW.COM (808) 847-3246, KFVEPUBLICFILE@HAWAIINEWSNOW.COM (808) 847-3246, KSIXPUBLICFILE@HAWAIINEWSNOW.COM (808) 847-3246, KOGGPUBLICFILE@HAWAIINEWSNOW.COM (808) 847-3246. But, that team is there to give future corrective actions, not to formulate lawsuits. Thank you, Bill. The Cove Mountain weather station is 8 miles northwest of the origin of the Chimney Tops 2 Fire, 5 miles west of downtown Gatlinburg, and 3 miles west of the last known western edge of the fire. I guess they are helping the people they always help and the rest of us are out of luck. Along with other Park issues like un-managed timber (very limited burns, mostly fields, not forested areas), we concluded the saying demolition by neglect. Why did they wait until Monday to do a voluntary a evacuation or were the city father is involved in the decision not to panic the thousands and thousands of people still there for the Thanksgiving holiday. Thus, private, State, or other agencies get left holding the bag, as it were. Increasing cloudiness and strong southerly winds on Monday ahead of the next storm system. I also wanted to let everyone know that the City and County is an example of nepotism at its finest. The fire could have been stopped over the weekend if proper procedures had been followed. It is a truism that many people want all the benefits of government, but dont want to pay for them. The teens, 15 and 17, were charged with starting the Chimney Tops fire which eventually spread to the Smoky Mountains, into Sevier County and Gatlinburg, killing 14 people, injuring more than. I realize some of my questioning is speculative and yet legitimate. The actual clifts are small and easily avoided. God doesnt cut financial budgets. Can fire experts examine burned areas and decipher the path of natural wildfire from managed ignited fires? Over 3000 wildfires received Initial Attack in November in the southern Appalachians, many of which were still very active when Chimney Tops 2 started. Very well said Tommy. Perhaps he needs a bit of prompting to remind him that the public will not forget what happened. Very good pictures! I learned so much from the Incident Management Team websites for the various big fires in the mountains (Cohuttas, Joyce Kilmer, Standing Indian, Boteler, Tellico, Party Rock, Pinnacle Mountain). Oct. 11, 2022, at 10:27 a.m. 1 Dead in Gatlinburg Fire That Affected Travel to Smokies. Classic Swiss Cheese risk management fire management failurehave we as a profession learned anything since South Canyon, Yarnell and now Chimney Top 2? This fire burned for almost a week, before it exploded into Gatlinburg. The official cause is down power lines due to high winds and fallen trees, according to a National Park Service news release. It is unfortunate that in our society people who speak out with a loud voice, or otherwise make waves for the privileged, get not only scorned but categorically destroyed by well planned out and financed design, often full of cover-up and lies and then propaganda is feed to the rest of us, of which we often take for gospel, when in fact is often not based on evidence or fact. At the official Gatlinburg weather station recognized by the NWS 0.73 inch was recorded on Tuesday. Bill, correct me if I am wrong, but aircraft should be on the ground a half hour after sunset? Until 1 p.m. sustained speeds were 4 to 6 mph with gusts at 12 to 19 mph. The remains of a business in Gatlinburg, Tenn., smolder on Nov. 29, after a devastating wildfire damaged or destroyed more than 2,000 buildings and killed at least 14 people. A lady answered phone. The fire continued to spread throughout the entire structure. My family lives 15 mi. Jim Renfro, the air quality specialist for GRSM, said the strongest wind gust recorded at Cove Mountain was 87 mph at 9 p.m. on Monday. We both were winded, nervous, and running to grab one change of clothes, night clothes, and tooth brushes. One person was found dead in the rubble of a fire that broke out in downtown Gatlinburg early Sunday morning. All downtown sidewalks reopened as permanent fencing around the building was installed by the property owner following the fire. This is just one more example of one more related issue that is seemingly un-connected until you delve into the issues deeply. Officials identified Robert A. Hejny, 63, who was found at Traveler's Motel in Gatlinburg. Granted these fires werent inside Gatlinburg, but the fire chief knew full well the potential for catastrophic wildfires in these mountains. My husband told me our children would not be happy with us if we did that, so we decided to leave without returning to the house. Those with information are urged to contact the Tennessee Arson Hotline at 1-800-762-3017 or the GFD at 865-436-5112. People responsible during the initial stages of the Chimney Top 2 wildfire need to be held accountable for violating these basic rules of fire physicsperiod. I wish the Feds had kept the case instead of handing it off to the local DA. Lets see what reviews done by people with expertise in wildland fire management come up with. They knew the high winds were coming days ahead of that Monday. Earlier on Tuesday, media reported that a man was arrested for setting three fires that spread into a 300-acre fire in. Copyright 2022 WVLT. They decided instead to monitor and to identifyon a map areas for indirect containment lines which encompassed 410 acres. However, when adequate risk analysis, proactive contingency planning and decision making, real time fire behavior simulations predicting possible disastrous outcomes, humans may have a much better chance of containing, or controlling, or herding, or managing or all-out suppressing an unwanted or unplanned ignition. Why? because poor, inadequate human decision making allowing basic fire physics, fire chemistry and TIME to align resulting in avoidable death and destruction! However, they are using a Super Tanker to douse the flames going on down there. Every business downtown was closed except for Bubba Gumps. Gatlinburg Fire 2016: How It Happened & the Aftermath - PigeonForge.com The report said the fire was an accident and caused around $7 million in damages. I have wanted to learn because I dont know enough to say much, but when I read your two posts about the loss of your cabin, and your escape, I felt I had to say, Im so sorry, to you, and probably speak for many many others who did not find this blog and find an avenue to learn, listen and to speak. And not only they had time to evacuate but I called 911 Monday night on Nov. 28 2016 and ask if there was any evacuation orders for Gatlinburg and was told By The 911 operator no not at this time Later found out the whole place was on fire at the same time I called 911 ( WHY ) was I lied to ? Im sure there will be lots of finger pointing, name calling pushing for blame and then legal actions. I loved the area, the town, homes, everything. I picked them up and came back home with plans of bringing truck back over mountain and filling it up because it was near empty. I am not convinced that all of what is considered to be the Chimney Tops 2 fire is. The aptly named Fire Cherry, Beech and Mtn. In late 2016, wildfires . So they were more concerned about NPS structures than our homes and lives? That is when it began moving rapidly toward Gatlinburg. But those heroes should have never been in that situation in the first place. It is so much easier to sit on the outside, pass judgement and sentencing in the name of accountability than it is to be involved in the event of vulnerability in action. State charges dropped in Gatlinburg fires - Smoky Mountain News Intention is important, even in a court of law, intention ways heavily on the sentencing. The park should have been begging for help and putting out warnings all week end!!! He was told there was none/no one. The further fire growth part was more accurate than they realized at the time. Other than the way the police were able to evacuate 4,000 people from Gatlinburg with little notice on Monday evening, everyone else involved did a very poor job. Where is his accountability? I have my own opinion on what I would do if I ruled the world but I can guarantee you two people that would be looking for work very soon . LeConte, is spread primarily, if not exclusively through the air.Though I havent been there in awhile, there used to be a stunning grove of Hemlocks in the Linville Falls area off the Parkway approx. Prescribed burning is a critical ecosystem management tool across the nation, especially in the Southeast (https://goodfires.org/how) and when the term is used interchangeably with monitored wildfires it can lead to confusion. They learned. Another factor in the tragic outcome goes way beyond any mismanagement of the fire in its early period. If the NPS backfires were not ignited on the 28th; then they had to be ignited on the 27th a day before the fire broke out. I know its good and natural periodically to let forest fires burn, but under the extreme drought conditions in this area, I was uneasy that fires werent being put out. I am positive that for anyone who gives of themselves to protect and serve will forever be haunted by that far more than anyone of us can expect to hold them accountable by lynching. They strive to their utmost and have a true passion working in GSMNP. Tommy Kirkland says: We may never really know the truth about this situation just as with so many other current and prominent situations. Then and only then will He let you effectively manage His creation that He has allowed you to be a part of for a short time. A stroke in 2011 left Akaka partially paralyzed and unable to speak but he didn't need words to express his joy to be reunited with it. Person killed in downtown Gatlinburg fire identified Thank you for making a point of the fact that we are all human beings with faults by design so that we need each other to succeed and survive. Would it be wise to implement backfire with such strong winds forecasted on top of exceptional drought and fuels? This would help the owners defray some costs so they can rebuild. Asked if I knew if there were any other people down in that area. Mike I appreciate what you said about a time and season for prescribed/monitored fire, and we need prescribed fire in the toolbox. But it is very important to point out that the fire that burned into Gatlinburg was never a prescribed fire. It's always sad to see the destructive forces of Mother Nature. This is how the devastating Gatlinburg wildfire erupted overnight By Angela Fritz November 29, 2016 at 1:06 p.m. EST Wildfires raging in the Tennessee resort towns of Gatlinburg and Pigeon. Im totally with you accountability. I later learned that Sevier County pays for an emergency notification system called Code Red Alert. I had heard that many of the stumps and rotted out trees had become abnormally dry because of the drought. This is as far as this subject needs to go; for the objective of this site is in regard to wildfire. LeConte. It is now time for aircraft (usually helicopters) to start washing the fire off the hill. However, by the time a federal judge dropped the charges six months later, some had lost focus on the fire. It is a primary source and illuminates some of the discussion topics that have been on Wildfire Today. Chalet Village Gatlinburg, Tommy there is a class action lawsuit being formulated by a Knoxville attorney. He actually wrote me back on Christmas Eve, of all things, to tell me that they will keep after it. Crews are currently taking down the China Bazaar and Puckers building. The big, dead hemlocks are light grey with a circular limb pattern as viewed from the air. And I dont write about that many of them. That didnt happen here. Once again: the questions remain unanswered. GRSM posted Fire Information signs in the area explaining their monitoring strategy due to vertical cliffs, narrow rock ridges and steep drainages. Whomever is in charge locally for the NPS should also be summarily fired. Often times in seeking to take out a person, the real root causes go unaddressed, and sometimes that includes some people taking the fall for decisions of others that were major contributing factors. The cleaner told officials he found Bates in the room where the fire started and had what appeared to be a warming fire going. Firefighting resources assigned to the fire include 25 hand crews, 61 engines, 6 helicopters, and 2 dozers, for a total 780 personnel. We drove carefully and made it out of woods into Pigeon Forge safely. The miracle is that more people did not It means they eliminated natural causes, such as lightning and volcano eruptions. The town I live in in Kentucky has a $500 fine for tossing a cigarette out the window and we do not even have The potential for many brushfires. On Wednesday, November 23, 2016 a hiker on the popular Chimney Tops Trail managed to capture a photo of two teenage boys dropping lit matches on the trail despite the current no-burn order in the area. I parked truck right beside a big mound of rip rap that Bob had dumped for lining the ditches on sides of our neighborhood roads, which arent through roads. Yes, there had been many fires in the southeast during the 6 to 8 weeks before the fire started in Great Smoky Mountains NP, but it is my understanding that at that time they had diminished and there may have been significant firefighting resources available. Then the wind comes!!! Until you sit in my seat after 20 years of fire service, making decisions on where to send your firefighters based on their experience levels, you will then realize decisions have trade offs and sometimes Mother Nature over rules you. It goes for miles, Ive pushed as hard as I could straight down and only managed 1/10th mile an hour on the gps in a few such places. If they do work as a pair, do they set multiple fires in the same area? What caused the fire in the Smoky Mountains? The electricity goes out almost everytime there is a high wind. There is simply too much BS. it would not be the first time that political or other motivation caused biased reporting. Sometimes we win and sometimes we lose. In my eyes, TEMA should have taken control of the situation and ordered evacuations before sunset. Suggestion, contact Dolly Parton or representatives of her holdings and give her (them) the emergency phone line to Global Supertankers. If the Park Service had done there job in the first place and City and County leaders would have stepped in and done something this could and would have been prevented. Arson charges dropped against teens accused in deadly Gatlinburg - WJLA Being an avid mountain hiker, I had seen evidence of fires from decades ago (Graveyard Fields being a macro example, but most prior fires in the forest were just like the ones this fall floor duff and fallen dead wood). FEMA did say they would give us a low interest rate loan, we dont want a loan we worked hard and paid it off and dont want to go in debt to rebuild! It was Congress that adjourned for the holidays without passing a bill to fund forest fire fighting efforts. GALLATIN, Tenn. (WTVF) Wildfires have ravaged Sevier County six years after deadly fires destroyed parts of Gatlinburg. The coordination and communication of the Incident Management teams is impressive. Circular holes in the ground spread around the forest floor for no apparent reason, no evidence in sight, no history of mining activity, most of the oldest living trees around the same height/age. I am not holding my breath. We really need to stop being so quick to cut of the heads of people doing their jobs and instead insist that they learn from and make changes for the better. Money. The NPS, IMO, did not take an aggressive stance on this fire, and that is usually the case with them. It seems that not even people in western areas have learned that lesson very well, and now it is time for those with homes and property in the east to realize they are at risk too. Instead simply took pictures on their phone, 3. For reference, 600 or above would indicate severe drought andincreased wildfire occurrence. Yes, some the ridges connecting to chimney-tops had dead hemlock stands. I was nervous about it. All of the big trees were gone (although younger trees had been treated and saved). National Park Service says never push a slower friend down when escaping a bear, Knoxville utilities crews work to restore power after intense storms, Missing elderly Knoxville woman last seen at hospital, police say, Vols drop to 5-seed in SEC Tournament after falling at Auburn, 79-70. fire Sunday morning destroyed their building. We drove down to Calhouns complex, through their parking area and back out onto the parkway and headed east. It is this same type of think tank and diversity we need in reaching a host of solutions to our complexity of problems both in this situation and in all others. I get free speech, but if I yelled fire in a crowded theater when there was none and it contributed to death and injury I too would be held liable; my speech would not be protected! We have a mountaintop cabin about 50 miles south of this area. There are many many folks who even if cell service were functional could not afford it. One Person Dead After Downtown Gatlinburg Fire Sunday Frankly people should lose their jobs and fault should be placed on their shoulders. The only way they will learn from the fire is if they have to face a jury of their peers to account for their ineptness even know they were in charge of protecting us and our homes and they did neither. Susan, FF get lulled into thinking they know by instinct but that era ininct will get people killed and thatas what happened. Not every fire manager gets the benefit of a meteorologist in your hip pocket, but there are many good weather websites available. My writing comes from the heart! Civilians are dead, millions of dollars of personal property destroyed, millions of dollars were spent on containing the wildfirethe rains/snow finally suppressed it. Damage was estimated at more than $500 million, according to Sevier County Mayor Larry Waters. I dont think so they were the people in charge not any of us and they didnt do their job. I love the mountains, but can I feel safe again? The businesses include Cafe 420 . Was the fire that inaccessible on foot? The learning system of resolution. Gatlinburg, Pigeon Forge wildfire evacuation information - WJBF Bob headed our way. We watched the news the rest of evening. They felt this was an attempt to start a forest fire and it was reported to officials. Kind of like closing the barn door after the cow gets out, dont you think? When we got to the bottom of the mountain, we ran into the Sevier County Electric crew where the road was blocked. there is still a nagging question regarding the use of BACKFIRE on the part of the NPS and the Gatlinburg Fires? http://www.knoxnews.com/story/news/local/tennessee/2016/12/13/timeline-gatlinburg-wildfires/95138656/. Multiple businesses were destroyed in the flames, totaling an estimated $7 million in damage. Without sufficient safe zones being created in advance each road was easily blocked either by fire or debris. Who knows what the climate will bring next year. I hounded the Knox News editor for a followup article around Dec. 19. There seems to be many people who just dont get that their are many areas in these mountains and in rural America that are no tech zones. My nightmare depicted more what happened in Gatlinburg than so far in Branson. A massive wildfire in the Tennessee resort towns of Gatlinburg and Pigeon Forge has destroyed more than 150 structures, including homes and businesses, authorities said Tuesday. Monday I was surprised to look at the Knoxville News and see nothing about evacuation notices. This isnt finger pointing its the simple facts of the entire situation like it or not! Wildfire experts have been warning local government officials about the potential for a fire of this magnitude for years. I have to assume that the city of Gatlinburg felt that since my road was county property that I was on my own. I said a quick prayer for safety and we started up hill to leave our truck. There is much opportunity in the Eastern Appalachians to better prepare citizens, towns , leaders and firefighters; To create more fire aware and safe communities. Accountability is important and paying the price for our decisions is too. time. Ive been told by others that they were waiting for the rain to move in based on the forecast and it didnt arrive when they expected so in the meantime they did nothing. Concerning the time the fire jumped 441. I have a close friend on IMT in southern CO so have some familiarity with the process. The Bob Stanton that has been commenting on this thread is NOT the former director of the NPS. Gatlinburg fire 10/9/2022: One body found after Parkway blaze One indicator of drought and its effect on how wildfires burn is the Keetch-Byram Drought Index(KBDI). He replied to me on Christmas Eve no less, that they were double checking all the facts to make sure all of their information was as accurate as possible and would keep digging. There should be accountability for those in charge, in every arena of governance and responsibility and at every level. But there have also been many times when these so called experts were thrust into a different climate or situation and they too experienced failures. If it was felt that people on this fire were at risk then dont staff the fire. Contingency plans for how to evacuate the entire town, regardless of the specific hazard, were not well thought out. I got out of the car and walked up to the side of the pickup truck. I wonder when NPS actually put out a request for Incident Management Team support. Maybe within the next year, well see some kind of progress come together, said Neddo. This is a text book example of waiting for rain and not planning for WHAT IF! Not just putting out the fires, but restoring the forest and trails afterward. Thats exactly what I plan on doing and recording the calls so that if they dont take action they an explain to the public why after getting all of these calls with people pleading for them to take action. The cause of the crash remains under investigation. Oh thats right they did but it was after everything burned! Everyone knew how dry it was. Chief Kurtz was right on target to compare South Canyon, Yarnell, and now Chimney Top 2. Jeanne: I do not disagree with your thought process regarding some of the broad challenges wildland fire mangers have faced in the past thirty some years. Case in point is our European religious history. It would make suppression efforts difficult, but a fire break could have been constructed around the original slow-moving fire in the early days. The Gatlinburg fire chief put out a notice for additional help to come to Gatlinburg around 11:52 pm. The Park Superintendent did not want to risk the lives of NPS fire crews with the Chimney Tops Fire 2; and that is to be respected. When I arrived in Branson at the hotel I was close to a fire exit, and frankly forgot about my nightmare. Everyone should also know that this area is characterized by mountain laurel, in some areas nearby its so thick the only way through is on top it or if your lucky under on your belly. Most excellently put, Jeannine (you are an exceptional writer). Dollywood flat out refused to even consider we needed any help and also tried to shame our neighbor to discourage home not to take it. It was as if time had passed with no motivational disaster to spur this awareness, at least not in my local community. Two Hawaii police departments are making moves to beef up incentives as recruiting efforts grow more competitive. The winds were getting stronger. 2 min read. Thanksgiving weekend is one of the 4 busiest weekends for Gatlinburg and the National Park. Perhaps all the firefighters prior experience was giving them mental slides that were no longer valid given the conditions. Tom, I want to express to you how sorry I am to hear about the loss of your cabin, what you went through escaping the fire, what you have gone through since the fire and what you are facing. Whether a tornado, hurricane or natural disaster, it weighs on your psyche. The GSMNP officials were able dodge the negligence and management shortcomings of the 2000 fatal black bear attack in Elkmont as well as discrediting and slandering a former District Law Enforcement Ranger who was involved in the incident. Just a quick comment per above posts. They couldnt get out a cell mssg. I am hopeful that there are enough folks taking note of and keeping a watchful eye out for this situation, so that lies and cover-up will be vetted.